SS2 Remake could be next

[6647edafd7b22Xkilljoy98]

Apparently a SS2 remake could be next, I mentioned this in another thread already but wanted to make it its own post as I feel like it is worth its own discussion

https://youtu.be/eJXUMr9guQs

[6647edafd7ce4Chandlermaki]

Please, for the love of god ND, leave it alone.

[6647edafd7dd1Xkilljoy98]

Yeah I only wonder how many years it would take and what all it would change

[6647edafd7f30icemann]

SS2 does not need a remake. Install SHTUP and SCP and your all good.

[6647edafd80c7voodoo47]

already mentioned this a couple of times, as long as SSR does ok, SS2R is pretty much a guarantee - will be much easier to pull off than SSR (they don't even have to recreate the audio and a few other assets), so there is no reason to not do it, extra cash is extra cash.

could be pretty ok if done right. IF DONE RIGHT.

[6647edafd835fXkilljoy98]

icemann
Yeah SS2 has mods but not everything has a mod, IIRC there are a few weapons like a few exotic weapons and some energy weapons like the shield generator that still don't have model replacer mods

[6647edafd85f7Xkilljoy98]

voodoo47
That is the thing "If done right", SSR changes a lot of the mood and ton from SS1, maybe if they give us an alt OST and lighting options then it could be solved but idk.

On top of that cuts some weapons, changes enemy design for some of them, cyberspace looks different, etc

SS2 is already more horror by default so maybe the changes wouldn't be as drastic though you never know.

And if they did away with SS1 music then they would probably get rid of SS2's music too, given SS2 music didn't always play but it when it did, it was good.

[6647edafd8723voodoo47]

SS2EE will be taking care of the few missing models, but even then, some people will want more. and if there's demand..

[6647edafd8b4cBerathraben]

Xkilljoy98
The lighting as seen in the current demo is no longer accurate. In the current beta it is far closer to that of the SSEE. So, you will be pleased about that. There are no pitch black areas anymore (at least not that are in the EE).

The music is still an unknown though at this point. I feel it is still subject to change and might not be final. It is still going to be a bit more ambient it seems. Hard to say though because some of the stuff Johnathon did was a better mix of ambient and techno so....

My feeling is it is not all in place yet. At least in the demo or beta. But on the back end might be. I dont know for sure though. It will be a surprise. As will whether the alt sound track is put in as an option. It only came up once in a dev stream and I recall Daniel saying we would see. I think this was because he was focused more on level design and Johnathon was all in on the music. Personally I think it will happen and that most of that is already done quite some time ago. Just not implemented fully in game yet.

Time will tell regarding the final product.

As for a SS2 remake. I think once the S 1 remake is out and if people really like it there will be a demand for a SS2 remake . It is a logical next step. And the pipe line will be much more stream lined.

Whether it needs it or not is up for debate. A part of me thinks "probably not". SS2 holds up very well for me but I have seen comments from some that it feels too dated.  but I would not kick a more modern remake of it to the curb either.

A SS2 remake probably hinges on how successful the first remake is.

[6647edafd8c6aicemann]

Thanks for the info . Good to know on the lighting and music.

[6647edafd8fb6Berathraben]

icemann
No problem. The lighting is the only thing I can accurately comment on at this point with any assurance though. But we know that NDS did a remix of the EE OST for the vinyl album. So, that work is done and if anything would be used for an alt OST my feeling is it would be that.

And we have heard a few of Johnathon's alt tracks that have a greater emphasis on techno over the current ambient stuff we are hearing in the demo. So, my thought is some of it is place holder or experiments . But I have not seen anything official beyond that.

Oh, and of course there is the intro music before the hackers apartment. That has a more upbeat techno vibe that has remixed elements from the original intro

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdRLDf0b2Og

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wbu0yITIoXQ

The music is very similar. Sorry that the one in the remake video is harder to hear. The person talks over some of it.  I will see if I can find a better one.

EDIT:  I just made this recording. The audio is better I think. But for some reason it recorded at a weird resolution. Oh well. It serves it's intended function.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_ygfI1rjow

 

[6647edafd93c8vurt]

Chandlermaki
Too late... they've been working on a remaster for years now, VR support being the most interesting part added. The updated models looks decent too.

Remake.. it would be 8-10 years into the future anyways, i'm not sure i'd be interested or alive lol

Nvidia RTX Remix looks interesting otherwise for us modders.

[6647edafd9afbXkilljoy98]

Xkilljoy98
The lighting as seen in the current demo is no longer accurate. In the current beta it is far closer to that of the SSEE. So, you will be pleased about that. There are no pitch black areas anymore (at least not that are in the EE).

The music is still an unknown though at this point. I feel it is still subject to change and might not be final. It is still going to be a bit more ambient it seems. Hard to say though because some of the stuff Johnathon did was a better mix of ambient and techno so....

My feeling is it is not all in place yet. At least in the demo or beta. But on the back end might be. I dont know for sure though. It will be a surprise. As will whether the alt sound track is put in as an option. It only came up once in a dev stream and I recall Daniel saying we would see. I think this was because he was focused more on level design and Johnathon was all in on the music. Personally I think it will happen and that most of that is already done quite some time ago. Just not implemented fully in game yet.

Time will tell regarding the final product.

As for a SS2 remake. I think once the S 1 remake is out and if people really like it there will be a demand for a SS2 remake . It is a logical next step. And the pipe line will be much more stream lined.

Whether it needs it or not is up for debate. A part of me thinks "probably not". SS2 holds up very well for me but I have seen comments from some that it feels too dated.  but I would not kick a more modern remake of it to the curb either.

A SS2 remake probably hinges on how successful the first remake is.

Glad to hear that the final will be bighter cause that demo and the reseach trailer are super dark.

Can you share a screenshot for comparison?

Also beta?, does that mean it is actually close to release this time?

I just don't understand why that want the ambiance or won't even confirm and alt OST as an option

I hope we get one, as the music was an essential part of SS1 and I can't imagine the game without, I don't wanna resort to YT or mods but I will if it is my only option

Besides an alt OST has to be the easiest thing in the world to do if they already have the music

[6647edafda84bXkilljoy98]

icemann
No problem. The lighting is the only thing I can accurately comment on at this point with any assurance though. But we know that NDS did a remix of the EE OST for the vinyl album. So, that work is done and if anything would be used for an alt OST my feeling is it would be that.

And we have heard a few of Johnathon's alt tracks that have a greater emphasis on techno over the current ambient stuff we are hearing in the demo. So, my thought is some of it is place holder or experiments . But I have not seen anything official beyond that.

Oh, and of course there is the intro music before the hackers apartment. That has a more upbeat techno vibe that has remixed elements from the original intro

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdRLDf0b2Og

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wbu0yITIoXQ

The music is very similar. Sorry that the one in the remake video is harder to hear. The person talks over some of it.  I will see if I can find a better one.

EDIT:  I just made this recording. The audio is better I think. But for some reason it recorded at a weird resolution. Oh well. It serves it's intended function.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_ygfI1rjow

An alt OST has to be easy to do if they already have the music, they have to know that some fans don't like the ambiance, right?, hopefully they give us something as music is important to SS1 and playing the demo it feels like that important piece is missing. Like I said, I will use mods or YT if I must but I hope I won't need to.

People have beta access?, that is awesome, who all is getting it?

At least if beta is going on that means that release could be close, but with so many delays before it is hard for me to 100% believe anything

But if nothing else I wish NDS would explain the reason for some changes

That last video is cropped weird

And it seems Level 3 story will give a 5 hour time limit instead of 7 and you will die permanently if dying when a restoration bay isn't on

But that techno music in the intro is better than I assumed it would be (aka nothing), wish they used that remixed OG intro they released years ago tho

Also I don't like Diego's new voice, and he looks a lot older

Anything else you would be willing to share?

But still seeing the actual intro is nice, lacks the same energy the original has but it's ok for what it is.

[6647edafdad51ZylonBane]

already mentioned this a couple of times, as long as SSR does ok, SS2R is pretty much a guarantee - will be much easier to pull off than SSR

Complete disagree. IMHO the reason Night Dive is capable of doing SSR is because they're recreating System Shock's very simple level geometry mostly as-is, with just a fresh coat of normal mapping.

SS2, on the other hand, was created when 3D game engines were on the cusp of being able to create fully realistic environments. For SS2R to justify its existence, it wouldn't be enough to simply import the original levels and slap updated textures on them. We already have that. They'd have to completely redo all the level geometry and detailing to bring the environments up to the standard of games like Prey, Alien Isolation, Soma, etc. That would be exponentially more work than it took to create SSR.

[6647edafdc167Jules]

Complete disagree. IMHO the reason Night Dive is capable of doing SSR is because they're recreating System Shock's very simple level geometry mostly as-is, with just a fresh coat of normal mapping.

SS2, on the other hand, was created when 3D game engines were on the cusp of being able to create fully realistic environments. For SS2R to justify its existence, it wouldn't be enough to simply import the original levels and slap updated textures on them. We already have that. They'd have to completely redo all the level geometry and detailing to bring the environments up to the standard of games like Prey, Alien Isolation, Soma, etc. That would be exponentially more work than it took to create SSR.

This. You've understood the problem of a SS2 remake very well. SS1 and SS2 belong to two different eras, and a remake of SS2 would need to be something on the same level as Prey or the Square Enix Deus Ex games. After all these years, Night Dive is still an Indie company in more than one way and given how much they've struggled to remake SS1 (with mixed results so far), a SS2 remake feels impossible (and, I should add, completely unnecessary. But it's not like I'm going to influence anyone's decision by saying this).

I'd definitely prefer to see Night Dive try its hand at making a game of their own. They definitely don't lack qualified people to attempt that. Isn't it more rewarding to create something that's truly yours, and avoid the risk of remaking something and possibly disappoint fans of the original?

Yep, I've somehow managed to acknowledge my own post 

[6647edafdc3c6voodoo47]

you can unacknowledge it again.

anyway, would think that remaking SS2 would be a more straightforward process - I imagine they had to redo a fair chunk of the SS1 levels to make them not look silly, and that wouldn't be much of an issue when converting SS2 levels. add a few toilets to Rick and you are good to go.

we'll see I suppose.

[6647edafdc520Xkilljoy98]

While SS2 isn't grid based like SS1, I still think it could be doable, it could possibly need a different approach in some places idk

Hopefully they learn from SS1R and would make SS2R in a more reasonable amount of time with less hiccups and more transparency.

[6647edafdc727Stingm]

I hope they don't do a System Shock 2 remake. We don't need one.

[6647edafdc8ceBriareos H]

That's the thing. Bringing SS1 to the masses was understandable, I've seen quite a few people complaining about a mass of pixels and arcane UI that is just too unplayable for a modern audience. SS2, on the other hand, set up with community patches is considered perfectly playable and a rite of passage for the imsim crowd. A modern remake would be way more controversial than SS1R. If you're going to invest in a System Shock game as much as Arkane did when making Prey, then just make SS3 (or let Arkane make it).

[6647edafdc9bfvoodoo47]

no strong feelings one way or the other.

[6647edafdcdf6ZylonBane]

If you're going to invest in a System Shock game as much as Arkane did when making Prey, then just make SS3 (or let Arkane make it).

Eh, Arkane already made their SS3. I doubt they'd have any interest in doing it again.

I'd recommend Frictional, since they absolutely nailed System Shock 2's horror vibe with Soma, but they have zero experience with shooter mechanics, which would be a pretty big handicap.

[6647edafddca7Chandlermaki]

Chandlermaki
Too late... they've been working on a remaster for years now, VR support being the most interesting part added. The updated models looks decent too.

A remaster is one thing. ND has proven to be fairly competent in that department. Fairly.

What they HAVEN’T proven to be competent at is making a good Shock remake, especially within a reasonable amount of time. Some of the decisions they’re making are still beyond baffling to me (seriously what the HELL are they thinking with the low-res textures).

[6647edafdde01Xkilljoy98]

I think EE fixed SS1's issues but I understand some wanting more