SSR: System Shock Kickstarter

[66413188afa04Gawain]

This isn't getting any better. At least they are consistent with the style...

[66413188b0143icemann]

IIRC this is made in Unity, so don't expect any form of modability unless they specifically build it into the game, which I wouldn't count on.

Unity was the engine of the original incarnation of the remake. Being done in Unreal now. If the Doom Eternal can come with a level editor (a game also done in the Unreal engine) then surely this could.

That said, going by the dev streams their "level editor" is Unreal itself, rather than a separate program. That would make modding and fan missions very difficult if at all possible.

[66413188b062aZylonBane]

Doom Eternal ... a game also done in the Unreal engine

/infinite facepalms

[66413188b076bicemann]

A google search reveals I was wrong there. My bad. Doom Eternal was done on the id Tech 7 engine.

[66413188b0dfcsarge945]

Unity was the engine of the original incarnation of the remake. Being done in Unreal now. If the Doom Eternal can come with a level editor (a game also done in the Unreal engine) then surely this could.

That said, going by the dev streams their "level editor" is Unreal itself, rather than a separate program. That would make modding and fan missions very difficult if at all possible.

1. Doom was done with the id tech 7 engine, not Unreal
2. You're thinking of Doom 2016, not Eternal. Eternal doesn't have a level editor.
3. Unreal is even less moddable than Unity because Unity is a component-based engine. Neither of them are particularly moddable. It's not like Unreal Engine 1 where you could crack open the Unrealscript and get to work.

Also, the fact that they switched engines gives me even less confidence in this project. Engine switching is a HUGE deal, and more often than not requires a complete total restart - all code needs to be thrown out and rewritten. Because of this, engine changes are only ever done when there's some significant feature that is necessary for a game which is basically impossible to get out of an existing engine. Usually it's graphics related. But the old version of the remaster looked fine, which makes me think that they changed engines because of largely superficial reasons, like "because Unreal is the current fad" or "Unreal looks nicer". It makes me think they have no idea what they are doing.

[66413188b1158ThiefsieFool]

there are tools to make mods for Unreal Engine 4 games, they just have limits
the encryption keys on the .pak files can be broken, and then you can extract assets and start to mod graphics, sounds, and some of the gameplay, provided the gameplay logic was done with Blueprints, as those can be converted to JSON and back
anything to do with the maps, or C++ is a different matter

[66413188b12e3edx]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgiYOcZwk9A

(think is the same one as the PC Gaming show, but haven't watched in detail)

[66413188b1464icemann]

Yeah thats the one from PC Gaming Show.

Rock, Paper, Shotgun did an article on the remake after having a play of the most recent build of it:
Link

Makes for an interesting read, of the perspective of a complete newcomer to the game.

They felt the combat was a bit off, liked the aesthetics, got completely lost in the cyberspace bits and wondered what the point of it was, wanted more tutorials / helper stuff (Night Dive needs to put back in the helper mode). In the end they felt the game was good for veteran players of the original but not for complete newcomers.

[66413188b1594ZylonBane]

The fact that the reviewer believed he was piloting a "little spaceship" in cyberspace does not fill me with confidence that he's qualified to render any sort of opinion on the remake.

[66413188b16f7ZylonBane]

Anyway, new Kickstarter update.

It's slightly maddening to me that they're blowing money on things like a playable Hacker apartment, prop Sparq guns, and a cosplay SHODAN, when the actual game has so many issues to be addressed. Hey Night Dive, how about spending some money on making that awful pixelated texture effect optional?

All these ancillary gewgaws smack of the sort of shiny distractions companies usually deploy when they know their product is crap.

[66413188b1a72RocketMan]

I wouldn't hold your breath.  Something tells me they are not making this game for the target audience you represent. 

They do however seem to be having fun with these ancillary gewgaws and their target audience will probably enjoy them as well.  Not surprisingly, I've had a meh attitude about this remake since very early on.  You'd do well not to stress over stuff you know they aren't going to capitulate on and just let them have their fun.  The ship has sailed.  If you or I can extract any value from the game, then it's a bonus.  I'm quite happy with the original game and never thought it needed any work.  JJ's variant is about the closest "remake" I would even bother with due to it's outstanding attention to authenticity.

[66413188b1bdbvoodoo47]

precisely. the source code(s) is where the meat's at, anything extra is just a bonus.

[66413188b1efeicemann]

All these ancillary gewgaws smack of the sort of shiny distractions companies usually deploy when they know their product is crap.

That's a bit unfair considering the effort put in. Having played all of the demo builds released I'd call it far from "crap". Sure the lighting is bad, and the pixel textures is a bit of an odd choice, but the gameplay seems good. Cyberspace is a bit of a mixed bag, as I found myself getting lost very easily in there, which never happened in the original.

Far too early to call really, until we get the full release and get to play with all of the mechanics. Aesthetic is one thing, but gameplay is the key factor.

[66413188b205bvoodoo47]

yeah, "we are not the target audience" is a good way of putting it. anyway, as mentioned a couple of times, this ship has sailed, it is what it is, we'll see how things will go once the game is out. and I actually don't think blowing some cash on a few props to draw some attention is a bad thing, if done properly.

anyway, "7/10, too bad they didn't listen to ZB's analysis posted on systemshock.org" is my prediction, feel free to quote me on that.

[66413188b2156ZylonBane]

The ship hasn't sailed until they release it. That's why the best time to complain about things is now.

[66413188b290eXkilljoy98]

I have said a lot on the remake already, but I will give my thoughts again since I can't remember if I have done so here or not.

Not a fan of many of the changes from the original.

Lack of the original music, darker lighting, lack of certain enemies/weapons/items, redesigned enemies/weapons/items, cyberspace has a different layout and look, etc.

Those are my main issues with the remake.

I guess I was hoping for something more 1:1 with the Original/EE when it comes to the look, feel, sound, and what is in it.

I some people don't mind or even prefer that it is different, but to me I feel like it is sort of a sequel, SS2, and SS1 combined together like they wanted to do all of them and combined them.

It doesn't fully feel the same way, like it is missing part of what made the original good.

I heard there may be some options for original things and I hope so or at least that some mods are made.

IK opinions can vary on the remake and maybe it might surprise me but that is how I feel about it.

The only thing the original needed changed was mouselook being added and the EE/mods did that, so I guess I was hoping for a more 1:1 remake of that with full 3D HD visuals. I am still curious about how it will turn out but I have my reservations and doubts given the changes.

Plus the 7 year wait with constant delays doesn't help things either.
XKILLJOY98
Also looking back, I forget I initially made this post, guess I forgot my password to my old account too (Or posted as a gues), but coming to think of it, I think I remember making a new one.

BTW for a TL;DR of my previous post:

- Levels too dark
- Original Music not in game (instead has unfitting ambiance)
- Missing weapons, enemies, and items.
- Redesigned weapons, enemies, and items.
- Cyberspace has different look and layout
- Playable intro lacks the same energy
- The boss fight and ending that was somehow leaked is completely different (you shoot the SHODAN cone from the ground in cyberspace) and lacks music in the fight and the ending after that also is missing some details and has unfitting/different music
- Lack of real knowledge on the state of the game combined with constant delays
- etc

On that topic, here are some resources for anyone that wants it:

Playlist of Trailers, Livestreams and Music (everything that I could find, there is one song that I can't find anymore):
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsUzRsxvwpYrdC53ptNcnz76XxXd1dpgh

Playlist of Music (should be complete):
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsUzRsxvwpYq3oTIpt6mucCb9P5WYpOB_

Playlists of NDS dev streams and interviews:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4M5hD35geYH1cr0UUkreKFwZYDzLio1w

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4M5hD35geYFtiSiIO5iwklNNbJ3lF3Qi

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4M5hD35geYFKfNsJ5w76o7khFF2nUi5g

The wiki page (of which I recently overhauled, it has every single piece of info, music, trailer, etc that I know of and could find):
https://shodan.fandom.com/wiki/System_Shock_(Remake)

The remake with the original music:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsUzRsxvwpYqE7f0b_5qvMmf3E035nZm5

The intro (no audio, now playable):
https://youtu.be/58PIX05pxpU

The leaked ending and boss fight:
https://youtu.be/K1KAwHwKsPE

[66413188b2a3cicemann]

Oh man, that sounds so much better with the remixed music in there. So much better than the ambient crap. Ending and boss fight I'll avoid watching. Not wanting to spoil it for myself (even if it ends up meh).

[66413188b2c72Xkilljoy98]

Yeah IK

Also they changed the release date to March 2023

Will they keep true to this one?

They’ve changed the release date so much idk if I can believe it, but if it is 99% done like they say then maybe this is accurate this time idk

I recently rewatched footage of the game when it was more of a full reboot with unique levels, and with that version I’m conflicted as while it is very different in terms of levels and some designs (music, feel, tone, etc too but that is also in the one we have now), I imagine that would have felt like a brand new experience and also maybe the changes wouldn’t have felt as unfitting of the whole game was built around them.

The remake now exists in a sort of uncanny valley, where the layout and some designs are the same but the look, feel, sound, etc is all different so it feels more out of place.

So idk if I would like it more or less

Probably less but idk still interesting to think about

[66413188b2e80JDoran]

If it was '99% done' then surely a release date before Christmas would be easily attainable, and a release date of a fortnight from now would be, barring a serious problem, possible? It's not even like they have to finish and finalize the code, then send it to the disc burning company, and wait for the game disc to be burnt, the manuals and disc boxes to be printed, and the game to be sent out to retailers, it's going to be a digitally downloaded game (at least for most people), so they can make it available for download the moment they decide it's ready to be distributed. And it no doubt will be shipped with bugs that will require post-release patches to fix (what game isn't, nowadays...?).

So why would we have to wait another five months for the game's release if it is almost ready now?

[66413188b2fa9Xkilljoy98]

Yeah that is probably true though if there will be a physical release idk

But this game more than anything NEEDS an original soundtrack option, all these interviews and how come no one asks about it?

Apparently a SS2 remake could be next

https://youtu.be/eJXUMr9guQs

[66413188b30b8voodoo47]

hopefully fixing all issues ZB pointed out.

[66413188b32f5Xkilljoy98]

voodoo47
ZB? issues?

[66413188b34a0ZylonBane]

There is zero chance they try to do a SS2 remake. SS2 is a sufficiently modern game already that they'd have to go really modern to justify a remake, and doing that sort of remake is how their first attempt at making SS1 crashed and burned.

As for them fixing all or even any of the problems I've pointed out... hahaha no, I have no expectations of them fixing anything. They seem pretty committed to their current dudebro design aesthetic. Neon lights and lighting bolts everywhere! So kewl!

[66413188b37a6icemann]

So why would we have to wait another five months for the game's release if it is almost ready now?

Well even backers wont get told of the reasons why, due to all the secrecy, so who knows,